Jeepweary you are absolutely correct about the cassette player. It didn't keep
the car from running and neither did the leaking sunroof, however the water pump that failed at just over 13,000 miles did. If you are going to consider
how reliable a vehicle is (regardless of the maker) you must take into consideration even the nitpickity stuff. If all the people who buy the imports
just pass over the minor problems when they respond to a Consumer Reports
survey, that alone could greatly alter the outcome of said survey. One of the
main reasons that I put very little faith in Consumer Reports is because I truly
feel that import buyers and domestic buyers are conditioned to judge their
vehicles differently. There is a belief in this country that success is measured
by how many inported items that you have. French wine is better than domestic, imported water is better than domestic, Italian shoes are better than
domestic and it carries right down to what kind of car you own. In addition to
my Cherokee I own a much maligned K-car based 1989 Chrysler Lebaron GTC.
Consumer Reports has never had anything nice to say about any vehicle based
on the K chassis. I have owned this car since new and it has been by far the
most reliable and dependable car I have ever owned. Currently the car has
a little over 78,000 miles and I am still on the original brakes and front struts.
My point to this is that I am a firm believer that most cars are very reliable
if you take care of them, so many people laterally beat the hell out of them
and then cry and whine about what a piece of shit their car is when its wore out
in three or four years. Your best bet Jeepweary is to talk to Jeep owners about
their experience with the brand.

Thanks for your input. XJKEN mentions the Toyota Corolla that had a factory installed cassette player that didn't work. While this can be frustrating and a pain to have to take it in to fix, it doesn't keep the car from running and getting you from point A to point B. I worry about the mechanical reliability of a car more so than the little "nit" picky stuff. GARY mentions his XJ that he had to change the "o" ring on the transfer case speedo housing (5 min, 50 cents) and the blower switch that you were able to fix yourself. Well first of all, I don't even know what the heck these two things are and I wouldn't be able to fix these myself. How much would it cost me to take to a dealer? What if it was not longer under warranty? You also mentioned your ex-wife's Toyota having more problems than the Jeep. Were they mechanical problems? or just nit-picky problems like the above mentioned cassette player that didn't work? MATT says that Consumer Reports hates Jeeps. Well I always thought that Consumer Reports was based on reviews and opintions of people who have owned these cars. So how can Consumer Reports hate Jeeps. And why would they choose to pick on Jeeps? They continuously rate Japanese cars, new and used much better than American made cars. Unless Consumer Reports is owned by the Japanese, I don't see what they have to gain by purposely rating American cars lower than Japanese cars. TWONABOMBER mentions a multi-function switch going bad. Sounds expensive. Was the Jeep still under warranty and the time. How expensive was this to fix. Hey, I would love to have the peace of mind of buying a Jeep, trust me, I love the new Liberty. My opintions towards Jeeps comes from input other than just Consumer Reports. I have talked to several people who either owned them or knew of people who owned them, and it's maybe 60% that they are reliable and 40% that they have multiple trips to the dealer for repair. Whereas with people with Japanese brand cars it's about 95% people who have NO problems whatsover other than changing oil and maybe new brakes after so many miles. Please don't say, then go out and buy a Japanese SUV. I posted these messages to get more input from other Jeep enthusiasts out there because I'm really seriously considering the new Jeep Liberty. Any and all input would be appreciated. THANK YOU!

Hey, nobody mentioned the Grand Cherokee winning another Petersen's award. I'm surprised they let the Grand back in again, it's supposed to be for new or substantially updated vehicles. Whatever. What will be interesting is to see how they compared it to the Liberty, which is certainly in the test group, and totally new. Apparently they were more impressed with the Grand. Last year, they said the Grand Cherokee made all the other entries look bad. We'll see when it hits the newstand in a month or so.

i don't care what Consumer Reports says. i haven't had any problems with my Wrangler, other than the multi-function switch going bad. i know others with Jeeps that haven't had any problems either.

Good point about the class the Liberty is competing in. Personally i think DC screwed up big time. The Liberty is too cutish to compete with the likes of the X-Terra, and Trail-Blazer. even though it's more vehicle than either and much, much more capable! On the other hand it is being and will continue to be compared to the cute-ute Rav-4, Honda whatever?, class. With the mileage it gets and the weight it has to carry the type of folks that buy a cute-ute would be better off with a more efficent model than the Liberty.

About the dependable comment... i've owned three Honda/Acura cars in the past and now have owned a 94 XJ (130,000Mi.), 00 XJ (24,000Mi.), and a brand new 01 TJ (3,000Mi.) I change the fluids, that's it. Jeeps are just as dependable... if not more so!

Consumer reports are a bunch of IDIOTS! They spread more false informaton than the nightly news.

here is my comment.............BULLSHIT !!!!!

I totally agree with your take on using the Cherokee name on the KJ. I too wish
they were using the Liberty name in all markets. It may be " King of the Cute
Utes" buts it no Cherokee.

I agree , I don't have a problem with the Liberty ( the vehicle or the name ).
Don't get me wrong I am a big time XJ fan. In fact I bought my '99 because
if you recall the Liberty was supposed to be introduced in the summer of 2000
before that date was pushed back to this past summer. I wanted to be sure to get an XJ before they were gone. I would do the same thing again because
that was the Jeep vehicle I wanted . Most XJ fans like the XJ's regardless of any
short comings the vehicle may of had. They are a very loyal bunch of Jeepers
who will probably never accept, much less like the Liberty. Most of us fail to see
why Jeep could not sell both vehicles side by side since they appeal to two
different customers. I would guess that if you asked ten different Jeep enthusiast what their favorite Jeep vehicle is, you would get ten different answers. It's for that very reason this automotive marque has grown to legendary status over the past 60 years. Hopefully the Liberty will induce that
same loyalty form its owners over time.

I can't believe so many people are against the Liberty name. Especially with the situation our country is in now. Liberty means freedom, and it has a special meaning for Americans, since so many fought and died for our liberty. I think it is a very patriotic and strong name. Perfect for a descendant of the vehicle that won WWII.

Ok I have a confession to make.... after
reading about 100 reviews of the Liberty "off
road".... (written by real Offroad testers".... and
after seeing a few Black & Dark Blue ones on
the road..... I have to admit.... even though I
would never want one myself.... and I like the
SC Xterra and my 99 XJ more.... still...they are
growing on me a little. I wouldn't mind seeing
my parents get one.... as they approach their
60's..... and I am even less hostile to this
vehicle when it's called a Cherokee. I actually
think that if DC knew they were going to end
the XJ production.... then they should have
called the KJ the Cherokee in the States as
well..... just to be consistent. The name Liberty
makes this vehicle sound even more
wussy.......

It's called the Liberty in Canada as well.

I was aware that markets outside the USA and Canada were using the Cherokee name on the Liberty....but seeing it in print like this just makes me want to puke.

KJ is called Cherokee everywhere but the US, at least from what i have been told.

Thank you everyone for your invaluable input thus far. Keep it coming, I love to hear from everyone about their experiences with Jeeps/Chrysler Products/New Jeep Liberty. While I agree with XJKEN that most cars are reliable if you take care of them, my feeling is and has always been that the overall percentage of Japanese cars vs. American cars that have problems is much less in the Japanese cars. I hear many, many more people complaining about mechanical problems with their American made cars than those friends, relatives, etc. that own Japanese cars. Which isn't to say that Japanese cars never break down or have problems, of course they do. But the likelihood seems more so with the American made cars. So it seems to come down to the luck of the draw, so to speak, alot of times. Did you happen to get a car that was built well or one that will be littered with problems its' whole life. Many people I know that have American made cars take very good care of them, but things keep going wrong. Chryslers in particular, I understand, have a horrible reputation for transmission problems. Many people I know of or have friends, relatives that they know of have either had wonderful luck with their Jeeps or they have had Jeeps that are always in the shop. Again, I can't believe that all those people didn't take good care of their cars. I think it's just the luck of the draw and that American made cars are more problematic at higher percentages than Japanese cars. Ford is the same way. Some people love their Fords (and have owned several) and many, many people I know had nothing but problems with their Fords (time and time again), myself included. I will not own another Ford product again.
AP!! from my experience. Also, another note to XJKEN -- I realize that the nit-picky stuff does count and if everyone ignored it it could alter the outcome of a survey, but I assume (maybe I shouldn't) that every car is going to have some minor nit-picky stupid thing go wrong with it or that isn't perfect (what's really sad is to think that some people might evaluate a car poorly not simply on a nit-picky broken item, but say for instance they hate the cupholders, so the whole car gets a bad review). I am much more concerned with what goes on under the hood and getting from point A to point B and will my car start in the morning, then say for instance the seatbelt that doesn't ever retract correctly in my '92 Toyota pick-up or my new 7 month old Toyota Tundra. So unless I pull on the seat-belt strap 8 out of 10 times when I get out of the car to pull up the slack, I end up slamming the door shut on the seatbelt. This is a royal pain in the you know what (I've taken in my '92 pick-up for this problem several times and it still does it, so I've resigned myself to the fact that Toyota doesn't design seatbelt retractors very well or something). But again, it starts, and it runs and in the 10 years I've owned the '92 pick-up I have had no mechanical difficulties whatsoever. I am a firm believer that Honda and Toyota put more money, thought, time, emphasis on what is under the hood than the refinement of what is in the car itself. For example: I don't know of any Toyota in my price range that would put or offer as an option radio control knobs on the back of the steering wheel, but the Jeep Liberty does! I love that feature. The Jeep Liberty and the Toyota RAV4 are in the same price range, but the interior of the Jeep Liberty kicks ass over the RAV4. The RAV4 is sooo much cheaper inside than the Liberty. Well, I have blabbed long enough. Keep the adivce coming, please. I enjoy it!!

In regards to the 2002 Grand Cherokee winning the Four Wheeler of the Year... the Overland model is new for the year and per their requirements (engine, trim, accessory changes) is a new auto. As for Consumer Reports, we are all consumers and our opinions are probably more accurate. Toyota and Honda will always be number one because they are assumed to be reliable. Americans autos must then be logically unreliable. But consider the source.... they include AWD wagons like the Outback, allroad, and X-Country in SUV tests. Since their idea of offroading is hitting a speed bump real fast and hitting slaloms, these wagons better win. Everyone must realize that there are no cars today with really poor build quality ( except maybe the rover and jags) and that these ratings are all subjective. Consumer reports rated my 2000 Laredo next to last, but my wifes Accord near the top. My Jeep (as with previous ones) has had zero problems, but her airbag module ($1200) went out after warranty expired. Looks like our household feels differently as many others do.

My ex wife's Toyota had mechanical problems-it ended up needing a new engine. My opinion is that Jeep service departments are like doctors-the less you visit them the longer you'll live. The o ring would have been cheap and easy fix for them to do. I doubt they could have found the other (electrical) problem. Older style Grand Cherokees are notorious for tranny problems, but new grands, Libertys and XJ's use different tranny's. XJ/TJ's require Girling or Castrol brake fluid in the brake and clutch resovoirs, but many dealers don't even know this and it ruins the systems. Jeep seems to use lightweigh components, like axles-especially the model 35c, that won't stand up to hard use. However many Liberty's and XJ's have the Chrysler 8.25 rear axle found on 3/4 ton vans with V-8's, which are much stronger. Look in the want ads, you'll see ton's of XJ's with well over 200k on them and still running strong. Jeep outsources many parts, which makes it harder for them to control quality. My XJ has a Toyota Transmission, a GM steering column, Dana front axle, Nipendenso alternator, and who knows what else. Consumer Reports bases their findings on problems identified in the first 15,000 miles, as far as I have heard. What I want to know is how a vehicle will hold up in the long run. Tell us if you like it.

I clicked on the South American web-site that lists the KJ as a Cherokee. What was interesting was the specs on the turboDiesel that we can't get in the US. It cranks out more torque than the V6 and at only 1800 RPM. If they offered that in the US I might rethink my position, since I always said if Jeep made a car I'd buy one-and now they've made a car. The problem with their car is that it only gets 20 MPG and has very little luggage space behind the rear seat (it looks like about half of what my XJ holds), and I'm too tall to see out the short windows. And it's ugly.

My 1993 XJ has 196,400 miles and it has never been in the shop except to have the tires and fluids changed (which I usually do-along with tuneups). I had to change the "o" ring on the transfer case speedo housing (5 minutes, 50 cents), and the blower switch, which fried the plug it attached to which in turn shorted the headlight switch (but I was able to fix it myself). My 1986 4 cyl was not as good, but in the 300k that i owned it I had far fewer problems (none the first 200k) than my exwife's Toyota Car.

here is my comment The people at consumer reports are a bunch of old men with bad backs to them the best car in the world is the honda accord.I have owned three jeeps in the past ten years & thay have all been dependable & reliabil trucks that I put through hell. thay also have the highest resale val. in they're class If you want to know what real people think about they're jeeps go to consumersreview.com & see for yourself.

It concerns me a great deal when ever someone uses Consumer Reports as
their argument for buying an import vehicle. My own sister-in-law won't make
any purchase unless Consumer Reports gives it their approval. I laugh every
time that strategy comes back to bite her in the ass, and that has happened
on three occasions that I recall. My 1999 Cherokee Sport is just about three
years old and the only problems that I have had are a seat belt retractor that
failed and an under hood light bulb that burnt out. Both items were fixed in
the same trip to the dealer, which means that in almost three years I have been to the dealer just once. In comparison several years ago my wife had a Toyota
Corola for a job she had, and during its three year lease it was back to the dealer three times for unscheduled maintance. In fact the factory installed
cassette player was not working the night we picked it up.

Actually Motortrend wrote an extensive article
on the trailblazer, lets face it, the only vehicles
capable of the type of offroading your talking
about, woudl be my CJ7 or other highly
modified vehicles. For moderate to light
offroad and real world conditions (Heavy
Snow, ect...) The trailblazer got great reviews. I
like the Xterra better then the Liberty, though
both are very good in basic off road and other
extreme conditions. My Cherokee is unreal in
any snow... I don't think anything will ever
match it .... I agree big time with twonabomber
or whatever your name is! Renault is going to
destroy Nissan...... I'll get the SC Xterra for a
few years..... but when that lease is up.... if the
future of Nissan is the hideous Renault
looking Crossbow...... then I imagine I'll
probably go back to Jeep, or a Chevy if Luts
builds something good performing & looking
by then......... Renault's vehicles are AWFUL
and they appear to be doing to Nissan with
their concepts what DC is doing to Jeep with
the Liberty!

I have 3 comments:
#1--As far as Jeep reliability goes, I think consumer reports is still mad about the CJ5 rollover story. The only Jeep I ever had problems with was my first one, a 1991 Wrangler. I went through 3 starters and 3 clutch master cylinders. I must have had a lemon, because guys at the jamborees looked at me like I was nuts when I said my Jeep had a lot of problems. My next jeep was a 1995 Cherokee that I traded in with 207,000 miles. I could count the problems I had with it on one hand, and they were all minor. It was just starting to use a quart of oil every 3-4,000 miles when I traded it in. My 2001 Grand Cherokee has 21,000 miles on it without a single problem. So, Jeeps are very reliable, and consumer reports just hates them.
#2--I don't know what you are talking bout, X-terra, with the Chevy Trail-Blazer. If ever I saw an SUV that was NOT geared towards the off-roader, this is it (except for the Ford Exploder). The front faschia hangs down like a minivan. I would scrape it pulling out of my driveway. I just went to the Chevy website, and looked at all the specs. They DON'T EVEN LIST ground clearance, approach and departure angles, or breakover angle. You may think the Liberty is too cute, or you don't like the idea of a Jeep IFS, but Jeep is still the only US manufacturer who makes all their SUVs authentic, trail capable 4X4's. Before anyone trashes my opinion, and says I must work for DC because I like the Liberty, just read what the automotive press is CONSISTANTLY saying about the Liberty. They are not all getting paid off by DC.
#3--Whether we like the comparison or not, vehicles are usually compared by size and price. So even if it bothers our ego, the XJ's competition was also the Kia sportage, Honda
V, etc. A lot of people bought XJs because they were more solid then bantam weights like these, for the same price, or they wanted a larger SUV (GC or Exploder) but could not afford them. The Liberty still has pretty much the same competition as the Cherokee.

a Liberty to Trailblazer comparison is a bit off, Trailblazer competes with Grand Cherokee. a Liberty would beat a P.O.S. Tracker any day. i rode in a friend's Xterra recently, it didn't inspire strong feelings either way. just wait, Renault wil kill Nissan just like they almost killed AMC...

1: Consumer reports BLOWS

2:Where do you get your info Sean M. that the
Liberty is much more of a vehicle then the
Xterra? I have now test driven both... I was
impressed with the Liberty .....but there is no
difference in quality or durability of these two
SUV's. That's why when my Cherokee lease is
up, I'm going to go with the better looking
Xterra.

P.S. If anything the Xterra has much better pick
up and feels much more nimble off pavement
(Like my XJ) ......then the Liberty...

P.P.S. Trailblazer is better then the Liberty or
the Xterra, but they don't offer it with a manual
tranny... if you think the Liberty is better then a
Trailblazer you are very very dilusional..

I don't understand how there could be sooo many people out there who love Jeeps when the reliability record for them is soooo bad. Consumer reports rates them very poorly. Or don't you mind how many times you take your Jeep in for repair and servicing? If, on the other hand you've had good luck with them, let me know.

Personally I don't believe Jeep has made a great vechile since the FSJs like the Cherokee, Grand Wagoneer, J-series trucks. The new modern ones are your typical run of the mill suv's

Hey...if you like the Liberty name...great. I hear what people are saying...and sure it does sound patriotic, and has a certain catchy appeal. At least Jeep (in canada / usa )gave it a new name for a new design.

I think what bugs me about calling the Liberty a Cherokee...is the fact that the two vehicles could not be any more different. So, by naming the Liberty a Cherokee....they are riding on the coat-tails of a classic. A classic that DC has abandoned.....rather shoddily I think...with the were keeping it in production...no were not turnaround in direction.

Here is another comment. I picked up my local newspaper today, and there is a big article on what is the best new vehicles for 2001. Well low and behold, there is the Liberty....and guess what it is up against in this article: Yep...the Suzuki XL-7, Saturn VUE, and the Honda
-V. And here is the headline: Four light-weight sport-utilities compete. Now as i have posted many times....this is the target market that the LIberty is aimed at. Whether the Liberty can handle the Rubicon or not....this target buyer could care less. The overwhelmingly vast majority of these buyers are more interested in good gas mileage. In this article, the Liberty was named the best ( because of it's more capable off-roading ), but then the reviewer says it's the most expensive, and weighs more, so maybe it would not be the best choice for most people reading the article. He also goes on to say that any of the 4 would be great choices...so there it is....Your new Liberty .... the king of the cute utes.

Now I could be wrong...but how many XJ owners who post here took the Honda
V...the Kia Sportage...the RAV-4 and the Suziki Vitara ( and other cute-utes in this class ) for a spin before buying an XJ. Not many I am sure. We did not want a cute ute poser....we wanted the real thing!

That's why dropping the XJ is such a huge bone-headed move. There is more and more mounting evidence that the Liberty buyer and the Cherokee buyer are, in general, not the same customer.

That's why many Cherokee owners are bothered by the fact that this great name is used on the Liberty in other markets. We want to see a new 2002 Cherokee introduced as well....but a REAL Cherokee!! Not a poser.

here is my comment
It would seem to be the correct name considering 9-11-01. I currently have a 97 xj which I love but, I would trade for a Liberty in a heartbeat. I'm rather short and would love a little more leg room and a place to put my left foot.
The Jeep ability is there. Why let the 'name' turn you away. It works, doesn't it?

Liberty is a weak name. they should have brought back a classic old name...i thought the original plan was to make Cherokees and Libertys for a few years, until Daimler decided to make so many cutbacks.

AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!
This sucks, the liberty sucks!!!!!!!!!
And in no way shape or form does it deserve the CHEROKEE name, thats why its the Liberty in the US, because all XJ owners would get out of there Cherokees and rip the Jeep Tag off of all Liberties(new cherokees).
SIGN THE XJ PETITION!!!!!!!:
http://www.petitiononline.com/no666/petition.html